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broommaster2000 · Moderator

I read an article today about self defence in the Netherlands. This year, a jeweller shot a criminal with an illegal gun. He still hasn't been convicted (that's what normally happens when you defend yourself over here) or anything.

A lawyer has said that it might be a good case to base better gun laws, or at least better self defence laws on, as the government clearly can't protect us (old news, but you know how things go).

Maybe we can defend ourselves by means of a firearm of some sort in the future over here.

I'm sure it'll stay stuck to a permit should it ever come to that, and the government will probably try to make a buck or two about that whole ordeal, including training courses that you have to pay for, but then again, our constitution states that it's the governments job to protect us from ourselves.

Still, an interesting development.

oddtodd · Silver Status Member

Broom, the self defense laws are just as complicated over here and you don't have to have a special permit to have a gun. I know of a local case of the guy clearly shot the invader in his home, but they filed involuntary manslaughter charges against him anyway.

Mark5043 · Silver Status Member

Self defense in general,and during home invasion is a super tricky,and convoluted subject.I can only speak for Ca.There is a common thought that if someone breaks into your house,you are justified in using lethal force,or force likely to cause serious injury or death.If a guy breaks into my house,I can't just shoot him,especially if he is unarmed.If the guy brandishes say a knife,and I have a gun I STILL can't shoot him.Same applies on the street if I had a permit to carry etc.The law would not be on my side,because it would be pretty clear that I had the upper hand.If he lunges at me,with the knife,then I would be justified in pulling the trigger.
The key here is the fear of certain bodily injury or death,and the escalation of the threat.If I shoot the guy just because he's in my house....I would be considered a murderer.Just because I'm afraid of what might happen is not enough to keep me out of the joint if I pulled the trigger.What LE wants you to do is if you have a firearm tell them to leave,and call it in.They don't even want you to restrain the person...because of escalation factors.Of course that would be a textbook situation,and of every case I've heard or read about it's never that simple. Rolling Eyes

Another thing that believe it or not they take into consideration is physical size,and power.I'm a bigger guy 6'7" 275.If the intruder or attacker on the street is smaller,and I just beat the hell out of him,then I'm in deep trouble.Get this....the POS would be able to sue ME for his damages.I can only use force sufficient enough to stop the threat nothing more.The same rules apply to LE.Sure if some crackhead breaks into my dwelling I may feel like unloading,an industrial sized barrel of whoop-a$$,worthy enough to produce a certifiably reformed individual....but when the dust settles...I will have to prove EXACTLY why I did what I did..... Rolling Eyes

again this is how it is in California....some states are more good ol' boy friendly...... Twisted Evil

sniper · Silver Status Member

some of you might remember the north hollywood bank robbery in 1997?? they followed the movie "heat". the family of the guy who bled out after being shot filed suit against the police who shot him. Rolling Eyes

(his partner ate his own bullet Laughing

)
they lost because the law reads that ems cannot enter into an unsafe zone.

i have a client who's retired LAPD. the cops can't shoot anyone any more unless they get shot at. pretty sick. i think if i wake up and find someone in my house with a baseball bat and i have a 1911 i should be praised and given an award with tax payers footing the bill on crime scene clean up services. Laughing

Mark5043 · Silver Status Member

xeene · New Member

texas has the best self defense laws. can pretty much shoot criminals on the spot.

Mark5043 · Silver Status Member