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Air Gun Home Forum Index » Optics » Scope not holding POI after sighting in Goto page 1, 2  Next    View previous topic :: View next topic  Scope not holding POI after sighting in   Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:24 am dr7197 Member Joined: 18 Jan 2012 Posts: 30 Location: New York Very frustrating. New Leapers scope 3-12X40AO. Hours sighting it in @ 20 and 30yds, eventually punching out dime sized groups with 18.1gr JSB's. Done? No... after making 10-15 shots in the group, shots start to drop, significantly. Two-three inches below expected POI! Or, after putting the rifle away for a day or so, it's completely off. Mounts are all tight, artilery hold the same way every time... Tried lighter pellets, RWS Domed 14g, same thing happens. What am I doing wrong? Thought it was the scope, so I put the Tech Force back on it.. Although its not as bad, it seems like its doing almost the same thing, but I think its probably me. Just worn out from HOURS of cocking and shooting! Shooting the RWS 350 Mag .22. Checked the barrel to ensure that it was screwed tight around the hinge and trigger. Everything seemed tight. Any ideas? _________________ RWS 350 Mag .22 Leapers 3-12X40 Gamo Shadow .177 Benjamin Discovery .22   Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 8:41 am SMP Silver Status Member Joined: 04 Feb 2011 Posts: 1183 Location: Just south of "Out There"- Land O Lakes Ontario If the POI is changing between shooting sessions there is a good chance it's your hold. I would suspect your grip hand is a good place to look. Try using just enough fingertip (no hand) pressure to be able to pull the trigger. When the gun fires it will likely twist a bit but try a few groups like that and see if the POI is consistent _________________ Sean   Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 9:23 am dr7197 Member Joined: 18 Jan 2012 Posts: 30 Location: New York SMP wrote: If the POI is changing between shooting sessions there is a good chance it's your hold. I would suspect your grip hand is a good place to look. Try using just enough fingertip (no hand) pressure to be able to pull the trigger. When the gun fires it will likely twist a bit but try a few groups like that and see if the POI is consistent Thanks for the advise SMP! I've actually done exactly as you explain with no change... I end up having to dial the elevation up, then fine tuning from there. Get it centered for a group, then it drops again (or goes up even higher..). Its almost as if the internal tube "moves" after its been adjusted. Could the RWS 350 Mag. just be too much for this scope? _________________ RWS 350 Mag .22 Leapers 3-12X40 Gamo Shadow .177 Benjamin Discovery .22 Re: Scope not holding POI after sighting in   Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 9:25 am dr7197 Member Joined: 18 Jan 2012 Posts: 30 Location: New York dr7197 wrote: Very frustrating. New Leapers scope 3-12X40AO. Hours sighting it in @ 20 and 30yds, eventually punching out dime sized groups with 18.1gr JSB's. Done? No... after making 10-15 shots in the group, shots start to drop, significantly. Two-three inches below expected POI! Or, after putting the rifle away for a day or so, it's completely off. Mounts are all tight, artilery hold the same way every time... Tried lighter pellets, RWS Domed 14g, same thing happens. What am I doing wrong? Thought it was the scope, so I put the Tech Force back on it.. Although its not as bad, it seems like its doing almost the same thing, but I think its probably me. Just worn out from HOURS of cocking and shooting! Shooting the RWS 350 Mag .22. Checked the barrel to ensure that it was screwed tight around the hinge and trigger. Everything seemed tight. Any ideas? I should've mentioned the the Tech Force was originally on this rifle, and was very consistent. So, I'm thinking its the new scope.... _________________ RWS 350 Mag .22 Leapers 3-12X40 Gamo Shadow .177 Benjamin Discovery .22   Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:05 am AirGunEric Site Admin Joined: 20 Jan 2007 Posts: 6930 Location: "Out There" As you keep adjusting the elevation- have you run out of adjustment thus far? Or, is the adjustment constantly slipping so this will never occur? _________________ ` I'd say "I care." But I'd be lying. Canadian Airgun Supplier: http://www.scopesandammo.com/storefront   Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:16 am dr7197 Member Joined: 18 Jan 2012 Posts: 30 Location: New York AirGunEric wrote: As you keep adjusting the elevation- have you run out of adjustment thus far? Or, is the adjustment constantly slipping so this will never occur? I haven't run out of adjustment.. yet. Each time I adjust elevation\windage, I tap the scope and mounts with a piece of pine. I've been told that this helps center the internal tube. Additionally, to compensate for barrel droop, I've put three layers of black electrical tape on the rear portion of the single piece mount. This helps me keep from maxing-out my elevation adjustment... _________________ RWS 350 Mag .22 Leapers 3-12X40 Gamo Shadow .177 Benjamin Discovery .22 Re: Scope not holding POI after sighting in   Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:46 am SMP Silver Status Member Joined: 04 Feb 2011 Posts: 1183 Location: Just south of "Out There"- Land O Lakes Ontario dr7197 wrote: Any ideas? I should've mentioned the the Tech Force was originally on this rifle, and was very consistent. So, I'm thinking its the new scope....[/quote] Ya that definitely changes things. Yes I would say the magnum springer is just too much for that scope. Also I would replace the black electrical tape with brass shim stock or a piece cut out of an aluminum soda can (pop can...depending on your ethnicity) The black tape is compressible _________________ Sean   Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:55 am rsterne Moderator Joined: 15 Jan 2008 Posts: 2998 Location: Coalmont, BC Quote: The black tape is compressible First thing I thought of as well, especially if the groups are moving lower.... Bob _________________ Dominion Marksman Silver Shield - 5890 x 6000 in 1976, and downhill ever since! Airsonal: Too many to count!   Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 2:44 pm dr7197 Member Joined: 18 Jan 2012 Posts: 30 Location: New York rsterne wrote: Quote: The black tape is compressible First thing I thought of as well, especially if the groups are moving lower.... Bob So do you think its because of the tape and not the AR? I really like the scope, but I have already made arrangements to return it. If I understand what's being advised; I should snip a piece of alum from a soda pop can, and use that instead of the tape? Not sure if I understand why the tape would "change" its thickness between sessions. The scope is tight in its mount, and I don't make any adjustments to the mount when sighting for elevation and windage... I really appreciate all of the help with this! I think the best solution will be a new PCP!!! _________________ RWS 350 Mag .22 Leapers 3-12X40 Gamo Shadow .177 Benjamin Discovery .22   Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 4:16 pm rsterne Moderator Joined: 15 Jan 2008 Posts: 2998 Location: Coalmont, BC Magnum springers ARE very hard on scopes.... I had a B-28 (350 clone) that destroyed two scopes.... If you are very near the top of the adjusting range they may not hold zero very well, even if you haven't "broken" it.... Bob _________________ Dominion Marksman Silver Shield - 5890 x 6000 in 1976, and downhill ever since! Airsonal: Too many to count!   Posted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 4:20 pm dr7197 Member Joined: 18 Jan 2012 Posts: 30 Location: New York Well, I guess I'll cancel the return. Just hope that the scope isn't bad... maybe I should just exchange it for another, then try the piece of alum for the droop.. Maybe I am too close to the top of the elevation, and thats why it needs constant adjustment? _________________ RWS 350 Mag .22 Leapers 3-12X40 Gamo Shadow .177 Benjamin Discovery .22   Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:06 am shawnhu Member Joined: 23 Jan 2012 Posts: 62 Hey dr7197, I'm also from NY, and have had the same problems that you are talking about. This is what I did to find, then fix my problem. I suspected the scope to be at fault, so I changed the scope. Same results. Then I suspected my hold, so I used my jacket or pillow as my stand to shoot from, and the shots would still be all over the place, mostly elevation variations with a good pellet. There would be times when the gun shot really well from 15 yards, but other times it would drop 2-3 inches. At that point, I had the gun sent back for another. The new gun came in, and shot very well. Same model, different gun. I'm now able to do a ragged hole 1/4" from 25 yards in .177 JSB Exact from a Crosman. Give the scope swap a try, and use something more consistant than your artilary hold to test the quality of your scopes and guns, then practice with artilary after you have confirmed that you have a quality gun and scope. Shawn   Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:59 pm AirGunEric Site Admin Joined: 20 Jan 2007 Posts: 6930 Location: "Out There" The OP is not describing shots "all over the place"- but a number of consistent shots, then a change of POI, then consistent shots at the changed configuration- an optics problem, not a rifle problem. _________________ ` I'd say "I care." But I'd be lying. Canadian Airgun Supplier: http://www.scopesandammo.com/storefront   Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:33 pm dr7197 Member Joined: 18 Jan 2012 Posts: 30 Location: New York shawnhu wrote: Hey dr7197, I'm also from NY, and have had the same problems that you are talking about. This is what I did to find, then fix my problem. I suspected the scope to be at fault, so I changed the scope. Same results. Then I suspected my hold, so I used my jacket or pillow as my stand to shoot from, and the shots would still be all over the place, mostly elevation variations with a good pellet. There would be times when the gun shot really well from 15 yards, but other times it would drop 2-3 inches. At that point, I had the gun sent back for another. The new gun came in, and shot very well. Same model, different gun. I'm now able to do a ragged hole 1/4" from 25 yards in .177 JSB Exact from a Crosman. Give the scope swap a try, and use something more consistant than your artilary hold to test the quality of your scopes and guns, then practice with artilary after you have confirmed that you have a quality gun and scope. Shawn Thanks for the insight Shawn. The more I learn about this, the more certain I become that it is indeed the scope. Regarding my shooting position, when sighting the scope in, the AR rests upon a pillow with my off hand, palm down, between the pillow and the AR. My cheek is barely touchiing the stock, and virtually no hand pressure on the grip. The only "resistance" the AR encounters on my behalf is my trigger finger. Once the scope is "dialed in", I can get nice tight groups for about 10-15 shots, then the shot mysteriously drops 2-3 inches and then I have to start all over again.. I'm hopeful that the scope was bad, and that the replacment solves the problem. I'm now debating as to whether or not I'll even put it on the RWS 350, may just save it for the Disco when I get it... _________________ RWS 350 Mag .22 Leapers 3-12X40 Gamo Shadow .177 Benjamin Discovery .22   Posted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:34 pm SMP Silver Status Member Joined: 04 Feb 2011 Posts: 1183 Location: Just south of "Out There"- Land O Lakes Ontario why not give the irons a try and see if the problem disappears _________________ Sean Scope not holding POI after sighting in     Air Gun Home Forum Index » Optics You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum All times are GMT - 5 Hours   Page 1 of 2   Goto page 1, 2  Next All Posts1 Day7 Days2 Weeks1 Month3 Months6 Months1 Year Oldest FirstNewest First  Select a forum Main Forums----------------AirGunHome Q&AGeneral Air Gun Questions and TopicsPicture GalleryTarget Shooting: Casual, Fun and CompetitionHunting, Pest Control, Varminting People/Events/Airgun Issue Discussion----------------Introduce YourselfThe BS TopicClubs/Events/Regional/Political Airgun Issues Maintenance, Modification and Reviews----------------RiflesPistolsAntique, Collector and Novelty AirgunsBB GunsPellets/AmmoOpticsAccessoriesAirgun Smithing Buy, Sell or Trade Forums----------------For SaleWant to Buy   Note: If you are seeing "Please enter your username and password to log in." 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