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Air Gun Home Forum Index » Hunting, Pest Control, Varminting » Just starting. Why only head shots? Goto page 1, 2  Next    View previous topic :: View next topic  Just starting. Why only head shots?   Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 8:29 pm redroush00 Member Joined: 31 Dec 2009 Posts: 78 Every shot i see from air guns are head shots. Isnt there a kill zone in rabits and squirrels that doesnt involve the head?   Posted: Thu Dec 31, 2009 8:56 pm rsterne Moderator Joined: 15 Jan 2008 Posts: 2998 Location: Coalmont, BC Sure, you can take them with a heart/lung shot like any other animal.... but you are unlikely to ever find any.... Squirrels will run and hide under a bush and bunnies will dive down a hole before they die.... Same as Grouse.... half the time with a body shot they will fly or run away and die.... A good head shot, they do the funky chicken and are easy to get to before they expire and their camoflage hides them.... Bob _________________ Dominion Marksman Silver Shield - 5890 x 6000 in 1976, and downhill ever since! Airsonal: Too many to count!   Posted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:35 pm domer_pyle Senior Member Joined: 17 Sep 2009 Posts: 523 if you must go for a body shot try and hit them in the shoulder socket. if they do try to run it will be in a circle assuming they can even run at all after that. but yes, a headshot is pretty much a necessity   Posted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:17 pm kanyon Silver Status Member Joined: 09 Aug 2008 Posts: 1582 Location: New Zealand I will body shot with a PCP As my PCPs are puting out a min of 45fpe...But with a springer you are really on the guns limit so a head shot is a surer bet... nothing worse than a rabbit running of with yer pellet "those things cost money" Peter   Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 6:41 pm redroush00 Member Joined: 31 Dec 2009 Posts: 78 so...why do Deer hunters never take headshots? These guys eat the dear not mount them. The run many yards and they sometimes have to waitr for them to die. Why do they always aim for the bread basket?? Seems less humane.   Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 7:29 pm fritz Silver Status Member Joined: 25 Nov 2008 Posts: 2442 Location: New Jersey- outside of Philadelphia Refer to pictures of deer with arrow stuck in head, years later. Some hunters (sadly) are not that good a shot. _________________ "I never set out to be wierd, it was always everyone else who called me it" -Frank Zappa Speed is impressive, accuracy is deadly. It's not that I'm not a people person, it's just that I'm not a stupid people person.   Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 7:41 pm kanyon Silver Status Member Joined: 09 Aug 2008 Posts: 1582 Location: New Zealand redroush00 wrote: so...why do Deer hunters never take headshots? These guys eat the dear not mount them. The run many yards and they sometimes have to waitr for them to die. Why do they always aim for the bread basket?? Seems less humane. They would if they were useing a air gun.... But a 308 or what ever has enough FPE to do the job almost anywhere...and the chest is a bigger target too... Pete   Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 8:12 pm Juggernaut0504 Member Joined: 03 Dec 2009 Posts: 44 kanyon wrote: redroush00 wrote: so...why do Deer hunters never take headshots? These guys eat the dear not mount them. The run many yards and they sometimes have to waitr for them to die. Why do they always aim for the bread basket?? Seems less humane. They would if they were useing a air gun.... But a 308 or what ever has enough FPE to do the job almost anywhere...and the chest is a bigger target too... Pete Another thing is well... dear are easier to find than a dead rabbit   Posted: Thu Jan 14, 2010 1:07 pm donec Senior Member Joined: 19 Dec 2009 Posts: 836 Location: central Texas Pflugerville area kanyon wrote: redroush00 wrote: so...why do Deer hunters never take headshots? These guys eat the dear not mount them. The run many yards and they sometimes have to waitr for them to die. Why do they always aim for the bread basket?? Seems less humane. They would if they were useing a air gun.... But a 308 or what ever has enough FPE to do the job almost anywhere...and the chest is a bigger target too... Pete Which means they don't have to be as accurate and they don't have to be as close and thus need less skill.   Posted: Sun Jan 17, 2010 8:32 am jlwilliams Veteran Member Joined: 02 Oct 2009 Posts: 264 Location: Jacksonville, NC USA rsterne wrote: Sure, you can take them with a heart/lung shot like any other animal.... but you are unlikely to ever find any.... Squirrels will run and hide under a bush and bunnies will dive down a hole before they die.... Same as Grouse.... half the time with a body shot they will fly or run away and die.... A good head shot, they do the funky chicken and are easy to get to before they expire and their camoflage hides them.... Bob And all this time I thought it was because squirrels ware zombies. Go figure.   Posted: Sun Jan 17, 2010 7:46 pm fritz Silver Status Member Joined: 25 Nov 2008 Posts: 2442 Location: New Jersey- outside of Philadelphia So there are other believers? I always had suspicions of zombie squirrels... _________________ "I never set out to be wierd, it was always everyone else who called me it" -Frank Zappa Speed is impressive, accuracy is deadly. It's not that I'm not a people person, it's just that I'm not a stupid people person.   Posted: Sat Jan 30, 2010 7:27 pm ledsmoke New Member Joined: 30 Jan 2010 Posts: 4 redroush00 wrote: so...why do Deer hunters never take headshots? These guys eat the dear not mount them. The run many yards and they sometimes have to waitr for them to die. Why do they always aim for the bread basket?? Seems less humane. Well as someone allready pointed out, not everyone is such a good shot. I´d like to add that allmost no one is such a good shot. I will never take a head shot on deer, because even though the bullets and the targets are immensely bigger than what is used with (most) airguns, the margin for error is so slim. With a deer most hunters agree that a heart/lung shot through the front legs if possible, is the best shot. It will kill the animal within literally seconds. However we must remember deer run at incredible speeds so we may find it 200 meters away from the point of impact. Regarding the smaller animals that are regularly hunted with airguns, the same problem exists. The head on these little animals are often the most mobile unit. Bobbing up and down for chow og vigilantly scouting the horizon, it sometimes seems that they never keep their heads still. I have shot my deal of rabbits with airguns, and here is my take. If it is more than 10 meters from its hole, a heart/lung shot will suffice. However, with rabbits there is a reverse proportion between its head and its heart/lung region. Meaning that the head is a bigger target than the heart/lung region. And if you can shoot a rabbit about 1 to 2 cm below the ears and a little aft of where the ears are, they normally lie down and go home. If shooting from the back, hit 1 cm below the ears and just in the middle. They lie down like you turned them off. Now for fowl I´ll go for a heart/lung shot every time with a airgun. If it flies away i´ll go for a bigger caliber next time. (generally I never hunt with the .177, because the kill zone of the .22 is 4 times bigger on any given animal) Remember, there is no substitute for caliber when it comes to hitting power. No amount of fps or fpe will change that. No special bullets with small do- dads glued to the tip will change that. No special alloy or plastic skirt or gold painted silly pellet with a shape of a hamster will do that. The best hunting pellets in my experience, are the common domed, looks like they always did, pellets. Use the same for hunting as for target practice, your confidence will be strong and your aimpoint the same as it always is. I mentioned the .22 has a 4 times bigger kill zone than the .177. Consider then that the .25 has a 4 times bigger kill zone than the .22. You probably see what i'm advocating here right.   Posted: Sat Jan 30, 2010 11:00 pm rsterne Moderator Joined: 15 Jan 2008 Posts: 2998 Location: Coalmont, BC Quote: Now for fowl I´ll go for a heart/lung shot every time with a airgun. If it flies away i´ll go for a bigger caliber next time Sorry, but I disagree.... sure a .22 is better than a .177, won't argue over that.... Even at the same FPE, it has way more momentum (ie knock-down power).... My experience hunting grouse is that with a head shot it's basically hit or miss.... If I hit them in the head with 20 FPE and an 18 gr. pellet they just flip all over the place.... even then I lose a few over a cliff or whatever.... stuff like that happens when you hunt, no matter how hard you try and avoid it.... When I try for a body shot.... unless I hit the heart (and sometimes even then).... they often fly away, and then lose altitude until they crash.... just far enough away that without a dog you can't find them unless you are very lucky.... If you shatter the shoulder, then they will often run off and die.... again, unless you have a dog.... Note, I'm not talking a wimply setup here.... 20 FPE at the muzzle, JSB Exact Heavy 18 gr. domed pellets that still have 16 FPE at 35 yards which is beyond what I ever shoot at.... Sure, you will sometimes turn them off like a light switch with a body shot.... and agreed, they don't do the "funky chicken" so it looks like a cleaner kill.... but I hunt for meat.... and every grouse I loose is not only not a meal.... but it won't get a chance to produce more the following year either.... In addition, I've seldom seen a body shot that doesn't lose at least a part of the breast meat, which is about all there is on a grouse anyway.... Although the body is a lot bigger target.... I got 21 last year with head shots.... so I think I'll stick to what works for me.... Bob _________________ Dominion Marksman Silver Shield - 5890 x 6000 in 1976, and downhill ever since! Airsonal: Too many to count!   Posted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 5:45 pm ledsmoke New Member Joined: 30 Jan 2010 Posts: 4 rsterne wrote: Quote: Now for fowl I´ll go for a heart/lung shot every time with a airgun. If it flies away i´ll go for a bigger caliber next time Sorry, but I disagree.... sure a .22 is better than a .177, won't argue over that.... Even at the same FPE, it has way more momentum (ie knock-down power).... My experience hunting grouse is that with a head shot it's basically hit or miss.... If I hit them in the head with 20 FPE and an 18 gr. pellet they just flip all over the place.... even then I lose a few over a cliff or whatever.... stuff like that happens when you hunt, no matter how hard you try and avoid it.... When I try for a body shot.... unless I hit the heart (and sometimes even then).... they often fly away, and then lose altitude until they crash.... just far enough away that without a dog you can't find them unless you are very lucky.... If you shatter the shoulder, then they will often run off and die.... again, unless you have a dog.... Note, I'm not talking a wimply setup here.... 20 FPE at the muzzle, JSB Exact Heavy 18 gr. domed pellets that still have 16 FPE at 35 yards which is beyond what I ever shoot at.... Sure, you will sometimes turn them off like a light switch with a body shot.... and agreed, they don't do the "funky chicken" so it looks like a cleaner kill.... but I hunt for meat.... and every grouse I loose is not only not a meal.... but it won't get a chance to produce more the following year either.... In addition, I've seldom seen a body shot that doesn't lose at least a part of the breast meat, which is about all there is on a grouse anyway.... Although the body is a lot bigger target.... I got 21 last year with head shots.... so I think I'll stick to what works for me.... Bob While I do agree with you on the meat preservation issue, consider my pow. If the grouse moves its head and you just nick it, it flies away. You think you missed it cleanly. The grouse thinks "where did my beak go and how do i eat or much less drink now?" The rationale being that it will suffer greatly before perishing and it will not produce more grouse the following year. A deer is also hunted for its meat, and if you aske me, the heart is one of the best pieces. It can be eaten immediately or combined with other parts of the deer in a stew. When I kill them, I loose 80% of the hearts. Complete write offs. And i Only hunt for meat, I´ve no pleasure in the kill, be it clean or otherwise. And I still dont do head shot, and for the same reason as with the fowl. If i nick it, and it runs away, I´ll never see the signs that it is hurt. So I think its clearly missed while it is sitting in a bush wondering about its lower jaw. Now I´ve never hunted grouse with airguns. Its not allowed where I live. And I´ve never spent any serious amount of time studying them as someone as experienced as you have. Therefore your judgment is king. But for me, its chest shots. And If they fly away, I try the .25 next time. If they still fly? .22lr hollow point and so on until i react a shotgun.   Posted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 6:27 pm rsterne Moderator Joined: 15 Jan 2008 Posts: 2998 Location: Coalmont, BC To each his own, I guess.... Bob _________________ Dominion Marksman Silver Shield - 5890 x 6000 in 1976, and downhill ever since! Airsonal: Too many to count! Just starting. 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